It’s the year of Pamela. The indie-pop duo from Sydney, made up of Sarah Ellen and Josh Kempen, have made their mark this year with debut EP It’s Nice to See You Here. Ellen, born in Sydney, and Kempen, born in Johannesburg, met in 2021 as strangers who became housemates. On the first night they spent living together, they discovered a shared love of music through admiration for Pink Floyd and The Strokes. Both had backgrounds in modelling, acting, art and songwriting, and they soon began making music together. After a spontaneous live show at the Pleasure Club in Newtown in 2024, the duo were convinced to pursue Pamela properly. Now, they’re on track to be one of Australia’s most exciting musical exports. 10 spoke with the duo, who’ve racked up millions of streams on their EP and sold out headline shows across Europe and Australia to talk music, heroes and what’s next.

10: Do you guys remember your first music memory?

Sarah Ellen: Oh, I know mine. Being Filipino, people say that we come out of the womb with a microphone because karaoke is a huge part of our culture. My first music memories were at big Filo family gatherings in living rooms with the karaoke box and my aunties and uncles, who were equal parts incredible vocalists and also tone deaf at the same time, singing Filipino lyrics.

So, you’ve been singing from the beginning?

Ellen: Yeah, I guess so. I never thought of that part of my life as part of my journey as a singer until now. But looking back, that’s probably why I get harmonies very well and I’m good at matching notes and things like that. Probably because I’ve been doing it since I was, like, four years old in my living room with my mum.

Josh Kempen: I think my dad gave me my musical taste. In the corner of our living room in Johannesburg he had a beautiful, big CD collection with vinyls as well, and a stereo and over-ear headphones. Looking back, I can still see the covers… the blue Dire Straits record [1985’s Brothers in Arms], and I remember the baby on the Nirvana record [Nevermind, 1991]. A few years later we were watching Channel V [after we’d moved to Australia] and Changes by David Bowie came on. I remember telling my dad to get off the phone to say, “How good is this?” And he was like, “Oh, you want to know about Bowie? Come upstairs.” He played me Space Oddity, Ziggy Stardust, Life on Mars… He knew all the lore behind Bowie. My mind was blown after that.

Your teenage years are so formative. Do you remember how you were both experiencing music then?

Kempen: That’s when I started writing songs, because I got an acoustic guitar for my sixteenth birthday. Or it would’ve been just prior to, because I knew that was my birthday present, so leading up to it, when everyone was out of the house, I’d grab the guitar out of the cupboard where I knew it was hidden and write music on it.

Ellen: Sixteen through to probably 19 were the years I experienced the most painful breakups, when you’re experiencing love for the first time and the weight of it all is just too much for your little teenage heart… I started writing music as a form of therapy back then on my acoustic guitar.

Let’s talk about your EP and these shows you’ve been playing. The last time I saw you guys was the night it came out on the day of this photoshoot, so how are you feeling now that it‘s out in the world?

Kempen: It’s surreal. When we saw you in Paris, we had Better Than Before out, and we noticed people recognise the song. These last two shows in London, the EP has been out for 10 days and there was at least a handful of people who knew all of the words to every track. It’s such a cool feeling because there’s streaming and then there’s the real world, and I don’t think those two places always intersect. It seems like we might be cultivating an audience who like our music, who actually actively participate in live shows.

Ellen: The vibe, especially at The Shacklewell Arms [in Dalston, East London]… We’d never been in a room where people were singing lyrics back to us, not even singing, but shouting lyrics back. There was a moment during our final song where I looked out onto the crowd, and I promise you every single person had a smile on their face and was dancing and singing. I will never forget that moment. That is why we started to make music, to make people feel good and connect with them.

Why do you think what you’re doing is resonating?

Ellen: People can feel and see how much care and thought we put into it.

Kempen: I’ve always thought that songwriting, especially in the pop landscape, is less about describing a feeling and more about bottling it. That’s just our natural proclivity, to bottle feelings like that in a song. That makes them accessible. Like if you go from Skin Contact to Better Than Before to Pandemonium, it’ll elicit a very specific feeling for anyone, and that’s what’s successful about the music and helps it land. We’re also just lucky to know each other.

It’s important for an artist to have conviction and follow their intuition, and you both believe in what you’re doing. What do you think makes a great indie pop song?

Kempen: Do you want to get granular? I think you need to have a mood. You need lyrics that are meaningful but are also open to interpretation. You need a top-line melody that’s separate to the vocal melody, but equally catchy.

Has growing up in Australia has infused its way into your sound?

Ellen: Absolutely. The festival culture that we grew up in, like Splendour in the Grass, Laneway, all these kinds of festivals were such a big part of my teenage years. I feel like that style of music is a part of who we are now.

I know you are both very involved in what you’re doing visually. How have you dreamed up the world of Pamela?

Ellen: We have a love for cinema and composition. Before we even started Pamela, we would dream up the visuals to the music we made because, at that time, there was no pressure in needing to make it for anybody else but us. We actually created a little document called the Pamela Bible, which was all things we were inspired by. From the very beginning, we had an incredible understanding of who influenced both of us and the direction we would want to go in.

Kempen: I’m sure if we looked at the very first one, it would be a very accurate representation of where we are now having released all these videos and songs.

I love the Pamela Bible. What are some staples of it that will be there forever?

Ellen: We just want to make people feel good. It sounds cliché but it’s important to us. The second thing is surrealism. Especially for our visual world there has always been an overarching theme of surrealism.

Kempen: Sarah, where do those visual ideas specifically come from?

Ellen: Usually it starts with me listening to music in my room! Salvador Dalí has been my favourite artist since the first time I visited his gallery [museum] in Montmartre, Paris, when I was 18. Which is funny, because that room we had an afterparty in at Bus Palladium [a five-star hotel that was once a club] was called the Dalí Room. He was the first celebrity to go to Bus Palladium, which is why they named that room after him.

Isn’t it crazy that was the room you were given on the day your EP was released? That’s a sign you’re on the right path.

Ellen: It was one of those woo-woo moments, which we love. I’ve always been inspired by him and the recurring symbols throughout his work that tell a story. I always want to have things in our work that don’t just look beautiful but are meaningful and symbolic.

Let’s do some quickfire. You are an iconic duo. Who are your favourite iconic duos?

Ellen: The White Stripes.

Kempen: Who’s the other dude in The Last Shadow Puppets? I was listening to them a few days ago. It was Alex Turner [and Miles Kane]… Wait, remember The Road to El Dorado, that cartoon? Those two are an iconic duo [Tulio and Miguel].

North Stars?

Kempen: I was always moved by what Matthew McConaughey said in his Oscar speech [in 2013, when he won for Dallas Buyers Club], where he spoke about his future self being the person he looked up to. I’m just gonna be quite honest and say I don’t see too many people in my universe who are on the same path as me. The only thing I can do is just try to imagine the best version of myself, 10 years from now, and try and head toward that.

That’s such a Scorpio answer, Josh.

Ellen: I need to think about this because it’s an important question. Someone asked us once who would you want to be your tour bus driver…

Kempen: That was me who asked you…

Ellen: Oh. Well, anyway, I said Oprah.

You would be so grounded on that tour. What have you learnt from each other?

Kempen: I don’t think visually very much. I hear the music, I hear the words, but I don’t see the visual world in the way Sarah does. So, it’s been a life-changing lesson doing this with her, because I’ve found that when we’re writing we’re now creating a world that is tangible. We’ve got a clear sense of what we’re building. I’m someone who takes one step at a time. I feel like I’m looking down at the path in front of me, but I’m in a band with someone who has their eyes up and is looking out there. You need both of those things. Sarah has a vision that goes beyond.

Ellen: Thank you, Josh. For me, the most valuable lesson Josh has taught me is to trust my own instincts. He’s very intentional with not only the music he makes but also the decisions that he makes in life. As well as that, he’s also my biggest supporter and puts so much trust in me. It’s empowered me to trust myself and back myself.

What’s inspiring you both right now aside from music?

Kempen: Oh, geez. I honestly don’t think I have a thought outside of music right now.

Ellen: This is going to sound so cheesy, but it would be my relationship. My boyfriend and I have been doing long distance for the most part of this tour, and just the way in which we feel so safe with each other and so secure and supported, I’ve never experienced anything like this in my entire life. It’s so inspiring to me. I’m like, “What the hell? How did I end up in such a healthy relationship?”

Love that. Last question: what’s next for Pamela?

Kempen: We have a new song coming out. There’s so much planned.

Ellen: We’ve been writing together for years and have so much music.

Kempen: I feel like I’m noticing Sarah becoming a little bit more partial to guitar music in the last few months.

Ellen: I’ve noticed that because our live show is such a huge part of our journey, now when we’re in the studio, we’re constantly thinking about how we are going to translate the sounds that we make into the live performance. So, we’ve been steering towards more organic sounds, like electric guitar and real drums and a real bass, rather than sampling or using sounds that are hard to replicate live.

I remember watching The Beatles Anthology, which came out in 1995, and seeing how much they played live and how important that was for them in creating a following. I think playing your live shows is what translates streaming numbers today into an audience that shows up in real life.

Ellen: I know it’s not many but there were at least 10 people who came to both of our gigs in London. They came to the Soho show on the first night [at The Lower Third on legendary music locale Denmark Street] and then the show on the following night too, back to back. I was blown away by that.

I’m certain I’ll speak to you again when there are hundreds of thousands of people singing your lyrics back to you.

Ellen: Thank you, Roxy.

Taken from 10 Magazine Australia Issue 28 - FUTURE, LEGACY, HERITAGE - out Friday.

Photographer ROB TENNENT
Fashion Editor JAIME BUTEL
Talent SARAH ELLEN and JOSH KEMPEN
Text ROXY LOLA
Hair ALEXANDER VAN DER HEIDE
Make-up GILLIAN CAMPBELL
Fashion assistant MIGUEL GARZA
Photographer’s assistant LACHLAN RYAN
Production BRONTE MOLYNEUX
With thanks to Bus Palladium, Paris
Clothes, bags and shoes throughout DIOR AW26

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